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Helping SD with BM?

Question:

>>> May I just say that I thought Moulin Rouge was the worst thing I’ve ever >seen.

I don’t know how I missed this the first time around.   I liked it.  I thought it was weird. Geri "I declare to you that woman must not depend upon the protection of man, but must be taught to protect herself, and there I take my stand." – Susan B Anthony

Response:

Geri and sometimes Brian wrote: > >>> May I just say that I thought Moulin Rouge was the worst thing I’ve ever > >seen. > I don’t know how I missed this the first time around.   I liked it.  I thought > it was weird.

Aha!  So that’s why I liked it! :-D Jennifer

Response:

> I thought >> it was weird. >Aha!  So that’s why I liked it! :-D

What else can you say about a story that blends the story of Camille with Elton John, the Monkees, and the Sound of Music?  It was weird in a cool kind of way.  :-) Geri "I declare to you that woman must not depend upon the protection of man, but must be taught to protect herself, and there I take my stand." – Susan B Anthony

Response:

Speaking of weird movies, I bought "Fargo" because Brian had not ever seen it. We watched that last night.  Everyone in that movie had a bad day. Tonight SD comes back, so we are going to see "Monsters, Inc."  I love this quote from it, "There’s nothing more toxic or deadly than a human child.  A single touch could kill you!" Geri "I declare to you that woman must not depend upon the protection of man, but must be taught to protect herself, and there I take my stand." – Susan B Anthony

Response:

In article <3BE343FB.7D0E8…@theironpig.com>, Jennifer  <gaz…@theironpig.com> wrote: >Wellllll, that sounds reasonable enough… <untwisting knickers while >she wonders if >she actually owns any knickers> :-)

Right, so you’re an veteran swearer who never wears panties and won’t accept no as an answer.  Hmmmm…. ;) >Jennifer (I even sat through Eyes Wide Shut)

Haven’t seen that, but I have read American Psycho Wendy

Response:

>Haven’t seen that, but I have read American Psycho

An excellent movie. Geri "I declare to you that woman must not depend upon the protection of man, but must be taught to protect herself, and there I take my stand." – Susan B Anthony

Response:

Wendy wrote: > In article <3BE343FB.7D0E8…@theironpig.com>, > Jennifer  <gaz…@theironpig.com> wrote: > >Wellllll, that sounds reasonable enough… <untwisting knickers while > >she wonders if > >she actually owns any knickers> :-) > Right, so you’re an veteran swearer who never wears panties and won’t > accept no as an answer.  Hmmmm…. ;)

Oh!!  Knickers are panties!!  No, you’re right, I don’t wear any of those, lol  ;-D And I like to consider myself an "accomplished" swearer.  It takes a bit of time to be as good as I am, but of course, I’m still learning! Jennifer, feeling puckish at midnight

Response:

Just to give you a slightly different perspective.  Consider this hypothetical: BM has 17 year old daughter who is driving her nuts in normal 17 year old ways, demanding security when she wants it and freedom when she wants it.  BD fights with BM, BM’s SO, and with SO’s kid.  BM feels her ex and his mate keep telling BD that things will be better back at their house.  BD throws that in her face whenever there is a problem at home.  Finally, BM says, "Fine, if you think it will be all sunlight and roses over there, just go!"   BD goes.  She is homesick.  She misses her mother.  She misses her friends.   However, BD rarely visits, and BM’s household has settled into a pattern without BD.  BM works out a new schedule with her mate, her house, her job, her friends.  When BD does come, BM rarely sees her and SO complains that she uses the house as a hotel and treats everyone in it like shit.   BD calls one weeknight and says that she wants to spend the weekend at BM’s. BM says it is not convenient that weekend.  She has plans and it is not convenient to drive a long distance to pick her up and drop her off.  However, she goes back to see if she can juggle things around so that she can work something out by Saturday.  BM suspects that one of BD’s friends is having a party that she wants to attend.  BD gets extremely upset and demanding. BM sees no sign of BD attempting to see her position and is exasperated that her daughter expects her to completely rearrange her life on short notice. jane – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Hi folks, >I thought I’d share what’s been going on lately and would appreciate any >insight to help my SD through this. >SD 17 and SS 15 haven’t seen much of their BM this fall, mostly because of >SS’s extra-curricular schedule. They’ve spent two weekends at BM’s house >since school started in late August (Saturday noontime-Sunday 6 p.m., >shortened weekends due to SS’s schedule). There was supposed to be another >weekend with BM a few weeks ago, but due to other circumstances, BM picked >them up at noon Saturday and dropped them off a little after 10 p.m. that >night. >I always assumed the schedule would get back to normal (every other >weekend at BM’s, or even possibly more if the kids wanted to spend more >time there), but SD said something a few days ago that makes me think she >doesn’t think it will get back to normal. >SD has been really missing her mother lately. Background: SD lived with BM >for 1.5 years before moving back in with her father, brother and me in >August. There were a lot of reasons for moving back with us… tension in >BM’s household with BM’s SO and the SO’s teen-ager; our ability to offer >SD some help toward her college education as long as we were able to claim >her as my dependent (tuition assistance through my workplace); and, as SD >admitted, she got a much bigger bedroom at our house and "that had a lot >to do with it." (Yes, I guess I have forgotten what it was like to be a >teenager!) >Anyway, for the past three nights on the phone, SD has asked BM if she >could spend this weekend with her, even though SS will be busy and can’t >do it. SD has been desperate to spend more time with her mother, and all >BM would say was "We’ll have to see." Last night, BM said, "we’ll talk on >Saturday." SD was devastated. There could be a number of reasons for BM’s >decision: >a) BM’s SO’s daughter (17, junior in HS), is pregnant. This has put a lot >of stress on the household. (I find myself dwelling on the mistakes I >think BM and her SO are making in this whole process — for example, >telling the girl she has to quit school and get a fulltime job to support >the baby — but I’m trying to make that not my business.) >b) SD and BM’s SO don’t really get along. >c) BM feels that her kids don’t need her in the picture much now that >they’re older, and is trying to encourage them to establish more >friendships/get jobs/do other normal teenager-type-of-things in our city. >(She lives about 50 miles away from us.) One way to do that is to make >sure they don’t visit her as often. >The situation has gotten bad enough that DH says he might talk to BM about >SD’s feelings of being pushed out of her mother’s life (she was in tears >last night). We’re not certain BM understands just how much SD misses >being with her. My question is for you is, as SM, what can I do/say to >help SD these days? Is there anything I should absolutely avoid saying? >(FYI: My relationship with SD is pretty good, I think. I found a >photographer for her senior pictures when we realized the "official" >photographer was way too expensive for our means; I took her shopping and >bought her homecoming gown for her, etc; of course, she doesn’t like it >when I do anything to correct her, even if I just say "Are you sure you >should be doing such and such?" but she seems to accept that, as an adult >in the house, I get to say things like that on occasion. Almost all the >time, I let her father handle any correcting/discipline/etc.) >Thanks for getting through all of this. I appreciate any insight you can >offer. >–Martha

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Wendy wrote: > In article <3BE1D8B3.5A02…@theironpig.com>, > Jennifer  <gaz…@theironpig.com> wrote: > >Wendy wrote: > >> In article <3BE09D85.78694…@theironpig.com>, > >> Jennifer  <gaz…@theironpig.com> wrote: > >> >Sounds like fun!  (Esp. the movie…let me know what you saw & your thoughts, > >> >’kay?)  <says the inveterate moviegoer> > >> May I just say that I thought Moulin Rouge was the worst thing I’ve ever seen. > >> Wendy > ><rolls up sleeves>  Now, them’s fightin’ words…put ‘em up…c’mon, > >show me what > >you Brits are made of…  :-D > Don’t get your knickers in a twist, I’m a peace loving, make everyone happy > kind of woman!  We’ll set up a charity to buy up all the copies just for you, > with the advantage that no one else need watch it ever again. *g*

Wellllll, that sounds reasonable enough… <untwisting knickers while she wonders if she actually owns any knickers> :-) Jennifer (I even sat through Eyes Wide Shut)

Response:

In article <3BE1D8B3.5A02…@theironpig.com>, – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Jennifer  <gaz…@theironpig.com> wrote: >Wendy wrote: >> In article <3BE09D85.78694…@theironpig.com>, >> Jennifer  <gaz…@theironpig.com> wrote: >> >Sounds like fun!  (Esp. the movie…let me know what you saw & your thoughts, >> >’kay?)  <says the inveterate moviegoer> >> May I just say that I thought Moulin Rouge was the worst thing I’ve ever seen. >> Wendy ><rolls up sleeves>  Now, them’s fightin’ words…put ‘em up…c’mon, >show me what >you Brits are made of…  :-D

Don’t get your knickers in a twist, I’m a peace loving, make everyone happy kind of woman!  We’ll set up a charity to buy up all the copies just for you, with the advantage that no one else need watch it ever again. *g* Wendy

Response:

In article <3BE09D85.78694…@theironpig.com>, Jennifer  <gaz…@theironpig.com> wrote: >Sounds like fun!  (Esp. the movie…let me know what you saw & your thoughts, >’kay?)  <says the inveterate moviegoer>

May I just say that I thought Moulin Rouge was the worst thing I’ve ever seen. Wendy

Response:

In article <filipic.3nospam-0111011223030…@dhcp34-115.ag.ohio-state.edu>,  <filipic.3nos…@osu.edu> wrote: >Another big disappointment. When DH was talking to SD yesterday about her >grades, he asked her, "Don’t you like being here with us?" (I’m not sure >how the conversation evolved in that direction, but…). And SD’s answer >was, "I’m not sure." Well, sheeyut. The one time she decides to tell the >truth instead of just telling us what we want to  hear, and it has to be >that. I’m stunned at how hurt I am by the revelation.

Martha, maybe her preoccupation with her BM is colouring her attitude to everything.  Try not to take it personally.  Sometimes the longing for one thing stops you appreciating something else you really value.  We all take those we love for granted at times.   Hugs Wendy

Response:

filipic.3nos…@osu.edu wrote: > Jennifer, I think you’re right, SD really is in touch with her feelings. > But she absolutely idolizes her mom (she calls BM her "hero") so I think > she is really becoming conflicted over this.

It’s crazy b/c you know her BM is not acting right toward her, and yet she gets to be the idolized one instead of you.  It sucks.  But as much as you want SD to know the truth about her mom, you know it’s a good thing that she only sees what she wants to see, otherwise the pain would be devastating.  If only the BMs knew how much we protect them sometimes… I continue to resist the urge, after 13 years, to throw the various truths about BM in SD’s face.  I…will..continue…to…do…so :-) > Well, the mall trip is now off — we got SD’s report card yesterday. She > received C’s in two subjects. One of those teachers commented "Required > work not complete," and the other wrote "Needs to complete homework." Even > in a subject that she got a B in, the teacher said she is capable of > better work.

You mentioned she’s a senior.  Has she applied to or been accepted at any colleges? What are her thoughts on next year?  Is this senior slump; IOW, has she done well in academics in the past?  Are the C’s in important classes or underwater basket-weaving?  Are you seeing her do her homework?  Is she just not understanding the material?  <waits for Martha to digest questions> > DH and I were so disappointed in her. It would be one thing if she was > striving to do her best, but that’s so obviously not the case. Especially > when we made it very clear when she moved back in with us that she needn’t > get a job (as BM was insisting) — that her job this year was her > academics, and she needed to concentrate on those.

What was SD’s response when you told her what you felt her priorities should be (which, incidentally, I agree with)? > She has given us good > lip service on this count, but she’s just not putting in the effort. You > know, I’ve even commented to DH on how little homework SD does (for being > a senior in high school)… now I know why. She just doesn’t do it!

Would you want to be more involved w/ her studies at this point, or do you feel it’s up to her now to put in the amount of effort she feels she should?  I know it’s got to be difficult since this is her last year of high school.  My SD is a sophomore, so she’s still at the "got to get good grades and academic success for future scholarships" stage (and we’re in the "continue to get good grades or stop swimming" stage, lol). > To be honest, she doesn’t put much effort into anything. We wanted her to > get involved in one extra curricular this year… anything, we’d help her > make it happen, whatever she chose. But she did nothing about it, beyond > just telling us what we want to hear. "I’m going to talk to the adviser > tomorrow." "I’ll have to see what activities they’re planning." But we > can’t tie her up and force her to do anything. Darn it anyway!

Well, some kids just aren’t into the extra-curricular scene :::waves hand wildly::: ;-)  I just wanted to go home after school, call a few friends, do whatever homework I needed to, and then read books and watch the occasional TV show.  I didn’t feel socially adept, but I was content enough w/ my group of buddies.  Since your SD isn’t doing anything outside of school, how does she spend her extra time?  Do you like her peer group?  Does she have a lot of friends and activities? I remember that being in your senior year you’ve got a lot of confusion and conflict about what you’re going to do in life.  Is it possible she’s feeling a bit depressed about what’s up ahead, and she’s just dragging her feet?  Is she enthusiastic about any particular thing that you could encourage (maybe something outside of school)? > Another big disappointment. When DH was talking to SD yesterday about her > grades, he asked her, "Don’t you like being here with us?" (I’m not sure > how the conversation evolved in that direction, but…). And SD’s answer > was, "I’m not sure." Well, sheeyut.

OUCH  <recoil>  Ooh, I wouldn’t ask any question like that.  I believe in my heart that SD loves being here and benefits greatly from it.  I also believe there are many times she feels she could do without the chores/siblings/being parented. But of course your question’s been asked and answered, so it’s out there and you can’t take it back.  What was the continuation of the conversation; that is, how did your hubby deal with her response?  Of course you’re hurt.  You know you’re putting in the time and love, and you want the appreciation.  If it’s any consolation, I’ve heard it takes until the children are all grown up until they tell you everything you need to hear…and mean it  :-) > So, anyway, DH and I talked and agreed that she needs to buckle down on > her studies in the next four weeks, and making a 2.5 hour trip to the mall > on a school night isn’t in the cards for her in the foreseeable future. > The four of us will still go out to dinner and a movie tomorrow night, > though. We’re thinking of seeing K Pax, but we’ll have to wait to see if > it’s still playing at our town’s cinema tomorrow night.

Sounds like a good plan.  We loved K Pax :-) > Well, there’s your answer then! (BTW, did you mean you’re counting on SD > to do a disappearing act at 18, or BM? )

Ah, that would be BM.  SD can hang around here w/ our blessing as long as she likes :-) Jennifer – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

In article <3BE09D85.78694…@theironpig.com>, Jennifer <gaz…@theironpig.com> wrote: > > filipic.3nos…@osu.edu wrote: > > Thanks for your responses. SD talked with BM last night, and though I > > don’t know exactly how the conversation went, I did hear SD say something > > along the lines of, "Well, I’d like to see you for more than a day this > > weekend," and then she said to her brother, "Take the phone. I’m mad, I > > don’t want to talk with her." Then the tears erupted. > It’s great that SD was able to tell her BM how she feels, even though she > obviously didn’t hear what she hoped to hear :-(  She sounds like a teen who’s > in touch with her feelings, which is helpful on the one hand, b/c she can be > expressive, but difficult, too, b/c she has a good understanding of exactly > what she’s missing and how she’s being rejected.

Jennifer, I think you’re right, SD really is in touch with her feelings. But she absolutely idolizes her mom (she calls BM her "hero") so I think she is really becoming conflicted over this. > > Still, DH did have a good long talk with SD. > Excellent :-)  Sometimes the best talks I’ve had with SD are when she’s upset > over something.  It seems to make the walls come down.

I hope so… unfortunately, I’ve gotten a little more cynical in the last 24 hours. > > I’ll have some time alone with SD tomorrow night (we’re going to a > > brand-spanking new regional mall that just opened last week) and I’ll talk > > a bit with her then, if she seems like she wants to. And DH and I decided > > that we’ll take the kids out to dinner and a movie Friday night, something > > special to soften the blow. > Sounds like fun!  (Esp. the movie…let me know what you saw & your thoughts, > ‘kay?)  <says the inveterate moviegoer>

Well, the mall trip is now off — we got SD’s report card yesterday. She received C’s in two subjects. One of those teachers commented "Required work not complete," and the other wrote "Needs to complete homework." Even in a subject that she got a B in, the teacher said she is capable of better work. DH and I were so disappointed in her. It would be one thing if she was striving to do her best, but that’s so obviously not the case. Especially when we made it very clear when she moved back in with us that she needn’t get a job (as BM was insisting) — that her job this year was her academics, and she needed to concentrate on those. She has given us good lip service on this count, but she’s just not putting in the effort. You know, I’ve even commented to DH on how little homework SD does (for being a senior in high school)… now I know why. She just doesn’t do it! To be honest, she doesn’t put much effort into anything. We wanted her to get involved in one extra curricular this year… anything, we’d help her make it happen, whatever she chose. But she did nothing about it, beyond just telling us what we want to hear. "I’m going to talk to the adviser tomorrow." "I’ll have to see what activities they’re planning." But we can’t tie her up and force her to do anything. Darn it anyway! Another big disappointment. When DH was talking to SD yesterday about her grades, he asked her, "Don’t you like being here with us?" (I’m not sure how the conversation evolved in that direction, but…). And SD’s answer was, "I’m not sure." Well, sheeyut. The one time she decides to tell the truth instead of just telling us what we want to  hear, and it has to be that. I’m stunned at how hurt I am by the revelation. I feel like suddenly I don’t know her at all. I suppose this is part of the step-relationship, and part of a relationship anyone has with almost any teen. I suppose I will get over it soon, but right now I still feel a bit wounded. So, anyway, DH and I talked and agreed that she needs to buckle down on her studies in the next four weeks, and making a 2.5 hour trip to the mall on a school night isn’t in the cards for her in the foreseeable future. The four of us will still go out to dinner and a movie tomorrow night, though. We’re thinking of seeing K Pax, but we’ll have to wait to see if it’s still playing at our town’s cinema tomorrow night. > I’ve heard there’s no disappearing act at 18, but frankly, I’m one of the > people counting on it, lol.  Seriously, if SD decides to commute from home, I > wonder which home *she* will choose, given the choice.  (She’s always been > 50/50 at both houses, alternating on a weekly basis.)  I know she has a > kick-ass bedroom at our house :-D

Well, there’s your answer then! (BTW, did you mean you’re counting on SD to do a disappearing act at 18, or BM? ) Thanks again for letting me sound off. –Martha – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Jennifer

Response:

Martha, I’m jumping into this thread really late, but wondered could you invite BM over to your house for dinner or something and then she could take SD out afterwards? Nikki – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Jennifer wrote: > filipic.3nos…@osu.edu wrote: > > Jennifer, I think you’re right, SD really is in touch with her feelings. > > But she absolutely idolizes her mom (she calls BM her "hero") so I think > > she is really becoming conflicted over this. > It’s crazy b/c you know her BM is not acting right toward her, and yet she gets to > be the idolized one instead of you.  It sucks.  But as much as you want SD to know > the truth about her mom, you know it’s a good thing that she only sees what she > wants to see, otherwise the pain would be devastating.  If only the BMs knew how > much we protect them sometimes… I continue to resist the urge, after 13 years, to > throw the various truths about BM in SD’s face.  I…will..continue…to…do…so > :-) > > Well, the mall trip is now off — we got SD’s report card yesterday. She > > received C’s in two subjects. One of those teachers commented "Required > > work not complete," and the other wrote "Needs to complete homework." Even > > in a subject that she got a B in, the teacher said she is capable of > > better work. > You mentioned she’s a senior.  Has she applied to or been accepted at any colleges? > What are her thoughts on next year?  Is this senior slump; IOW, has she done well in > academics in the past?  Are the C’s in important classes or underwater > basket-weaving?  Are you seeing her do her homework?  Is she just not understanding > the material?  <waits for Martha to digest questions> > > DH and I were so disappointed in her. It would be one thing if she was > > striving to do her best, but that’s so obviously not the case. Especially > > when we made it very clear when she moved back in with us that she needn’t > > get a job (as BM was insisting) — that her job this year was her > > academics, and she needed to concentrate on those. > What was SD’s response when you told her what you felt her priorities should be > (which, incidentally, I agree with)? > > She has given us good > > lip service on this count, but she’s just not putting in the effort. You > > know, I’ve even commented to DH on how little homework SD does (for being > > a senior in high school)… now I know why. She just doesn’t do it! > Would you want to be more involved w/ her studies at this point, or do you feel it’s > up to her now to put in the amount of effort she feels she should?  I know it’s got > to be difficult since this is her last year of high school.  My SD is a sophomore, > so she’s still at the "got to get good grades and academic success for future > scholarships" stage (and we’re in the "continue to get good grades or stop swimming" > stage, lol). > > To be honest, she doesn’t put much effort into anything. We wanted her to > > get involved in one extra curricular this year… anything, we’d help her > > make it happen, whatever she chose. But she did nothing about it, beyond > > just telling us what we want to hear. "I’m going to talk to the adviser > > tomorrow." "I’ll have to see what activities they’re planning." But we > > can’t tie her up and force her to do anything. Darn it anyway! > Well, some kids just aren’t into the extra-curricular scene :::waves hand wildly::: > ;-)  I just wanted to go home after school, call a few friends, do whatever homework > I needed to, and then read books and watch the occasional TV show.  I didn’t feel > socially adept, but I was content enough w/ my group of buddies.  Since your SD > isn’t doing anything outside of school, how does she spend her extra time?  Do you > like her peer group?  Does she have a lot of friends and activities? > I remember that being in your senior year you’ve got a lot of confusion and conflict > about what you’re going to do in life.  Is it possible she’s feeling a bit depressed > about what’s up ahead, and she’s just dragging her feet?  Is she enthusiastic about > any particular thing that you could encourage (maybe something outside of school)? > > Another big disappointment. When DH was talking to SD yesterday about her > > grades, he asked her, "Don’t you like being here with us?" (I’m not sure > > how the conversation evolved in that direction, but…). And SD’s answer > > was, "I’m not sure." Well, sheeyut. > OUCH  <recoil>  Ooh, I wouldn’t ask any question like that.  I believe in my heart > that SD loves being here and benefits greatly from it.  I also believe there are > many times she feels she could do without the chores/siblings/being parented. > But of course your question’s been asked and answered, so it’s out there and you > can’t take it back.  What was the continuation of the conversation; that is, how did > your hubby deal with her response?  Of course you’re hurt.  You know you’re putting > in the time and love, and you want the appreciation.  If it’s any consolation, I’ve > heard it takes until the children are all grown up until they tell you everything > you need to hear…and mean it  :-) > > So, anyway, DH and I talked and agreed that she needs to buckle down on > > her studies in the next four weeks, and making a 2.5 hour trip to the mall > > on a school night isn’t in the cards for her in the foreseeable future. > > The four of us will still go out to dinner and a movie tomorrow night, > > though. We’re thinking of seeing K Pax, but we’ll have to wait to see if > > it’s still playing at our town’s cinema tomorrow night. > Sounds like a good plan.  We loved K Pax :-) > > Well, there’s your answer then! (BTW, did you mean you’re counting on SD > > to do a disappearing act at 18, or BM? ) > Ah, that would be BM.  SD can hang around here w/ our blessing as long as she likes > :-) > Jennifer

Response:

Wendy wrote: > In article <3BE09D85.78694…@theironpig.com>, > Jennifer  <gaz…@theironpig.com> wrote: > >Sounds like fun!  (Esp. the movie…let me know what you saw & your thoughts, > >’kay?)  <says the inveterate moviegoer> > May I just say that I thought Moulin Rouge was the worst thing I’ve ever seen. > Wendy

<rolls up sleeves>  Now, them’s fightin’ words…put ‘em up…c’mon, show me what you Brits are made of…  :-D Jennifer (LOVED Moulin Rouge and Nicole Kidman’s work in it)

Response:

Jennifer wrote: > filipic.3nos…@osu.edu wrote: > But of course your question’s been asked and answered, so it’s out there and you > can’t take it back.  What was the continuation of the conversation; that is, how did > your hubby deal with her response?  Of course you’re hurt.  You know you’re putting > in the time and love, and you want the appreciation.  If it’s any consolation, I’ve > heard it takes until the children are all grown up until they tell you everything > you need to hear…and mean it  :-)

Look, if it’s any consolation, it’s probably at least 80% teen response. Mine from time to time bursts forth with "I can’t wait to go away!" I suspect  there’s a sort of ‘leave the nest’ instinct that makes all parents of any stripe boring at that age. Jennifer is right, IMO; you’ll have to wait a few years for real appreciation. And probably like 20 for it all to sink in, when she’s a parent herself. Rupa

Response:

filipic.3nos…@osu.edu wrote: <snipped> > Sigh. OK. Thanks for letting me get that off my chest. I know our BM isn’t > nearly as bad as ones many of you put up with, but personally I can’t wait > until she is completely and utterly out of our lives. (That will happen > magically once the kids reach 18, right? Right?)

Nope.  Much as I hate having this particular realization, unless the kids cut ties with the other parent(s), you’ll still have occasional contact with them.  And if the kids feel close enough to you to talk about their worries and frustrations, you’ll hear about the other parent(s) – for the rest of your life. — Kitten "I am no longer abuse@<nowdefunctportal>.com.  It is no longer my job to help clueless lUsers.  I release them to their ignorance and the consequences thereof.  I *DON’T* need to hand-hold every person I ever encounter who *chooses* to remain totally clueless.  It is *NOT* my job to mother them nor to help them learn how to communicate effectively with other people."

Response:

<filipic.3nos…@osu.edu> wrote in > Sigh. OK. Thanks for letting me get that off my chest. I know our BM isn’t > nearly as bad as ones many of you put up with, but personally I can’t wait > until she is completely and utterly out of our lives. (That will happen > magically once the kids reach 18, right? Right?) > Martha

Martha, It sounds to me as if your SD is so lucky to have you in her life.  I find it so very sad when supposed ‘parents’ pull this type of thing with their children. Best wishes to you and your family. Cal~

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In article <3BE011CB.DAE19…@whitepine.com>, Caitriona Mac Fhiodhbhuidhe – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<kit…@whitepine.com> wrote: > filipic.3nos…@osu.edu wrote: > <snipped> > > Sigh. OK. Thanks for letting me get that off my chest. I know our BM isn’t > > nearly as bad as ones many of you put up with, but personally I can’t wait > > until she is completely and utterly out of our lives. (That will happen > > magically once the kids reach 18, right? Right?) > Nope.  Much as I hate having this particular realization, unless the > kids cut ties with the other parent(s), you’ll still have occasional > contact with them.  And if the kids feel close enough to you to talk > about their worries and frustrations, you’ll hear about the other > parent(s) – for the rest of your life. > — > Kitten

Yes, intellectually I realize this. Emotionally, I wish it weren’t so! I guess it won’t be so bad when the kids are well established in adulthood and they won’t be as affected (I hope) by BM’s quirky (to put it nicely) parenting style. In fact, I  have fantasies of conversing with an adult SD, telling her how angry I used to be at her BM for treating her so unfairly as a teen. I realize the day may never come where such a conversation would be appropriate or welcome, but I can dream, can’t I? Speaking of the future, one concern of mine is that, when the time comes, SD will want BM to join SD and her father as they walk the aisle at her wedding, and that DH won’t be able to find it in himself to go along with this. Hopefully, SD won’t request this, or at least by then, resentment will have faded and DH will be able to swallow his pride to make his daughter happy. Tsk. I know I shouldn’t fret about such things. Let me just concentrate on this weekend, and help SD get through this "I miss my mom" period. Thanks again, and more input is always welcome… –M.

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filipic.3nos…@osu.edu wrote: > Thanks, Jennifer and Rupa, > Thanks for your responses. SD talked with BM last night, and though I > don’t know exactly how the conversation went, I did hear SD say something > along the lines of, "Well, I’d like to see you for more than a day this > weekend," and then she said to her brother, "Take the phone. I’m mad, I > don’t want to talk with her." Then the tears erupted.

It’s great that SD was able to tell her BM how she feels, even though she obviously didn’t hear what she hoped to hear :-(  She sounds like a teen who’s in touch with her feelings, which is helpful on the one hand, b/c she can be expressive, but difficult, too, b/c she has a good understanding of exactly what she’s missing and how she’s being rejected. > Still, DH did have a good long talk with SD.

Excellent :-)  Sometimes the best talks I’ve had with SD are when she’s upset over something.  It seems to make the walls come down. > I’ll have some time alone with SD tomorrow night (we’re going to a > brand-spanking new regional mall that just opened last week) and I’ll talk > a bit with her then, if she seems like she wants to. And DH and I decided > that we’ll take the kids out to dinner and a movie Friday night, something > special to soften the blow.

Sounds like fun!  (Esp. the movie…let me know what you saw & your thoughts, ‘kay?)  <says the inveterate moviegoer> > In the meantime, please let me vent a bit at BM here: > BM, when will you get your head out of your arse and realize that the > decisions you make have profound effects on your kids???

(snip rant)  I know this probably doesn’t make you feel any better, but there are many people here–count me as one of them–who’d be thrilled to have the BM doing the absent parent act.  I know SD loves her BM, but it’s hard to have to deal with another parent’s influence on a child you consider yours, esp. when your parenting styles differ.  It’s obviously tough on your SKs to have BM far away and unavailable, but at least you get to be there for your SKs doing the real parenting :-) > Sigh. OK. Thanks for letting me get that off my chest. I know our BM isn’t > nearly as bad as ones many of you put up with, but personally I can’t wait > until she is completely and utterly out of our lives. (That will happen > magically once the kids reach 18, right? Right?)

I’ve heard there’s no disappearing act at 18, but frankly, I’m one of the people counting on it, lol.  Seriously, if SD decides to commute from home, I wonder which home *she* will choose, given the choice.  (She’s always been 50/50 at both houses, alternating on a weekly basis.)  I know she has a kick-ass bedroom at our house :-D Jennifer – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

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I agree with Rupa that it would be good for you to sit down and chat with SD, let her know you’re there as a shoulder to lean on.  But I would leave it to your DH to choose whether or not to bring this up with BM.  I think it’s a judgment call.  My judgment? I’d leave it between BM and the kids, who are old enough to make their wishes known. If BM’s 17yo DD’s calls aren’t enough to convince BM she’s needed, I doubt anyone else will change her mind. Jennifer

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Thanks, Jennifer and Rupa, Thanks for your responses. SD talked with BM last night, and though I don’t know exactly how the conversation went, I did hear SD say something along the lines of, "Well, I’d like to see you for more than a day this weekend," and then she said to her brother, "Take the phone. I’m mad, I don’t want to talk with her." Then the tears erupted. DH realized that his talking to BM wouldn’t do anyone any good, and decided not to. (Our relations with BM are surface-polite, but strained. Even before their divorce, DH and BM had very different parenting styles anyway, so it would be unlikely that they would see eye to eye now.) Still, DH did have a good long talk with SD. We all know that things are strained at BM’s house these days, and DH tried to help SD figure out why BM might be making the decisions she is making. He also talked about how cutting off communication isn’t a good way to work out differences, and they talked a bit about the months late last year when SD and DH didn’t speak to each other. Again, I didn’t catch most of the discussion… it was obviously a private conversation and I kept myself busy in the kitchen while they talked in the living room. But their talk seemed to have helped. I’ll have some time alone with SD tomorrow night (we’re going to a brand-spanking new regional mall that just opened last week) and I’ll talk a bit with her then, if she seems like she wants to. And DH and I decided that we’ll take the kids out to dinner and a movie Friday night, something special to soften the blow. In the meantime, please let me vent a bit at BM here: BM, when will you get your head out of your arse and realize that the decisions you make have profound effects on your kids??? First, you moved an hour away from them just as they were entering their teen years, ostensibly to be closer to work. But you’ve never held a job for more than two years. When that job fizzled out, you spent 45 mins. to an hour driving to your next job. And yet you never made a mid-week trip just to visit your kids to be more a part of their lives, claiming "It’s so far," or "It’s such a long drive." Are you nuts? You’re the one who moved in the first place! Then, you and your SO were dating only a few months when SO and family moved in with you. When the kids protested at the suddenness of the decision, you told them, "It’s happening. Get used to it." For heaven’s sake, they just wanted to talk with you about it! They wanted reassurance that this wouldn’t affect your relationship with them! You stupid, stupid woman. Now, you’re trying to talk them into joining the military as a way to pay for their college education. Even now! When joining up could very well mean fighting the frickin Taliban! And this is the ONLY college help you’re offering. Argh. You’re a lousy parent. I hope your kids are able to figure a way to work through this, because if they don’t, they’ll have some problems for a long time to come. You idiot. I’m so glad the kids are with us. But they still need you to be a significant part of their lives. Please stop failing at that. Please, for their sakes. Sigh. OK. Thanks for letting me get that off my chest. I know our BM isn’t nearly as bad as ones many of you put up with, but personally I can’t wait until she is completely and utterly out of our lives. (That will happen magically once the kids reach 18, right? Right?) Martha In article <3BDF249A.2177…@theironpig.com>, Jennifer – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<gaz…@theironpig.com> wrote: > I agree with Rupa that it would be good for you to sit down and chat with SD, let her > know you’re there as a shoulder to lean on.  But I would leave it to your DH to choose > whether or not to bring this up with BM.  I think it’s a judgment call. My judgment? > I’d leave it between BM and the kids, who are old enough to make their wishes known. > If BM’s 17yo DD’s calls aren’t enough to convince BM she’s needed, I doubt anyone else > will change her mind. > Jennifer

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Hi folks, I thought I’d share what’s been going on lately and would appreciate any insight to help my SD through this. SD 17 and SS 15 haven’t seen much of their BM this fall, mostly because of SS’s extra-curricular schedule. They’ve spent two weekends at BM’s house since school started in late August (Saturday noontime-Sunday 6 p.m., shortened weekends due to SS’s schedule). There was supposed to be another weekend with BM a few weeks ago, but due to other circumstances, BM picked them up at noon Saturday and dropped them off a little after 10 p.m. that night. I always assumed the schedule would get back to normal (every other weekend at BM’s, or even possibly more if the kids wanted to spend more time there), but SD said something a few days ago that makes me think she doesn’t think it will get back to normal. SD has been really missing her mother lately. Background: SD lived with BM for 1.5 years before moving back in with her father, brother and me in August. There were a lot of reasons for moving back with us… tension in BM’s household with BM’s SO and the SO’s teen-ager; our ability to offer SD some help toward her college education as long as we were able to claim her as my dependent (tuition assistance through my workplace); and, as SD admitted, she got a much bigger bedroom at our house and "that had a lot to do with it." (Yes, I guess I have forgotten what it was like to be a teenager!) Anyway, for the past three nights on the phone, SD has asked BM if she could spend this weekend with her, even though SS will be busy and can’t do it. SD has been desperate to spend more time with her mother, and all BM would say was "We’ll have to see." Last night, BM said, "we’ll talk on Saturday." SD was devastated. There could be a number of reasons for BM’s decision: a) BM’s SO’s daughter (17, junior in HS), is pregnant. This has put a lot of stress on the household. (I find myself dwelling on the mistakes I think BM and her SO are making in this whole process — for example, telling the girl she has to quit school and get a fulltime job to support the baby — but I’m trying to make that not my business.) b) SD and BM’s SO don’t really get along. c) BM feels that her kids don’t need her in the picture much now that they’re older, and is trying to encourage them to establish more friendships/get jobs/do other normal teenager-type-of-things in our city. (She lives about 50 miles away from us.) One way to do that is to make sure they don’t visit her as often. The situation has gotten bad enough that DH says he might talk to BM about SD’s feelings of being pushed out of her mother’s life (she was in tears last night). We’re not certain BM understands just how much SD misses being with her. My question is for you is, as SM, what can I do/say to help SD these days? Is there anything I should absolutely avoid saying? (FYI: My relationship with SD is pretty good, I think. I found a photographer for her senior pictures when we realized the "official" photographer was way too expensive for our means; I took her shopping and bought her homecoming gown for her, etc; of course, she doesn’t like it when I do anything to correct her, even if I just say "Are you sure you should be doing such and such?" but she seems to accept that, as an adult in the house, I get to say things like that on occasion. Almost all the time, I let her father handle any correcting/discipline/etc.) Thanks for getting through all of this. I appreciate any insight you can offer. –Martha

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filipic.3nos…@osu.edu wrote:

The situation has gotten bad enough that DH says he might talk to BM about > SD’s feelings of being pushed out of her mother’s life (she was in tears > last night). We’re not certain BM understands just how much SD misses > being with her. My question is for you is, as SM, what can I do/say to > help SD these days? Is there anything I should absolutely avoid saying? > (FYI: My relationship with SD is pretty good, I think. I found a > photographer for her senior pictures when we realized the "official" > photographer was way too expensive for our means; I took her shopping and > bought her homecoming gown for her, etc; of course, she doesn’t like it > when I do anything to correct her, even if I just say "Are you sure you > should be doing such and such?" but she seems to accept that, as an adult > in the house, I get to say things like that on occasion. Almost all the > time, I let her father handle any correcting/discipline/etc.)

What’s your relationship with BM like? Any chance of being able to sit down and have a chat about it? I can see how her household might be pretty stressed with a teen pregnancy in progress, and also I can see how SD might discount all that. If her mom cares about her, she should be able to make it up to her in some way, even if she can’t actually have her spend extra time there. If you’re not on friendly terms with BM, there may be little you can do except provide a shoulder to SD. Tell her you enjoy having her around. Tell her you like the responsible young person she’s becoming. (Or more casual words to that effect.) And that growing up and becoming independent is hard for everyone… Perhaps knowing that you care should help by itself, independent of what her BM does. Rupa

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