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Airline Pilots:Sophisticated Bus Drivers

Question:

No, he’s WAY off.  Airline pilots aren’t sophisticated bus drivers. They’re more like sophisticated TRUCK Drivers. That little door that separates the cockpit from the cabin also separates two totally different worlds.  From the flight deck’s viewpoint, they could be hauling people, bombs, cargo, mail, or nothing at all. They fly the plane and that’s all they care about.  Passengers are just noisy, late, demanding, and ignorant cargo.  They are best dealt with by the flight attendants.  Just like the dock workers who load the freight aboard trucks. Unfortunately, with the increased pressures of security, scheduling, revenue maximizing, and the quest for profits, the whole airline experience has become totally de-humanized.  The flight deck crew can do little to remedy this, they end up just driving that big truck from hub to hub. A show of hands of GA pilots who hate to fly the airlines. . . Remember when they served real food on real plates, in normal-sized seats.  . Now it’s cram ‘em into coach and toss ‘em trays of re-heated bland food in portions that would not interest the homeless. All things considered, that Grumman Tiger looks more and more like the way to go. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – …when he was working as an airline pilot he was just a  " SOPHISTICATED BUS DRIVER."

Response:

Who cares?  It’s still a lot of fun to fly an airplane and the pay’s not too bad either.  When I’m flying for the airlines, you can call me what you want but as long as I’m having fun I really don’t give a damn.

Talked about this with another Baron driver (135, freight) while jumpseating with him.  It came down to this, his wife had a corner office in a tall building, and she loved the view.  His wasn’t a big corner office but the view out the window kept changing.  I feel the same way.  I have been flying for over 11 years now and have seen this country from many different cockpits at many different altitudes.  I still enjoy it, even if I am paying for it.  I made flying my profession because I couldn’t afford it as a hobby.  If somebody really doesn’t like flying for a living at any level, tell them to move aside for somebody (me, you, her, him, them) who does like it. Jim Hann ATP/MEL CFIAIME

Response:

Some time ago I met the owner of a flying school that was a former airline pilot. Everytime he could, he said that when he was working as an airline pilot he was just a  " SOPHISTICATED BUS DRIVER." What is your reaction to such statement? Respectfuly, Raul Soto

I think that people make that "observation" because the public still thinks flying is black magic and reveres pilots. Other pilots see through the BS and feel the urge to be negative (especially GA guys). I have relatives and good friends who are airline pilots, and I am always a little taken aback by their blue-collar "anti-management", union attitude. They have no more idea about how a business works than a typical drill-press operator. That may be some of the reason that they get put down. BUT! That does not make them bad or make flying a bad profession. It is still a neat thing to do. And they enjoy what they are doing, which is most important. Also, *someone* has to do it, so why try to put them down? BTW, anyone who has dealt with the general public, especially know-it-alls like the "TWA Incident" boy, would be understanding of pilots who show just a teensy bit of disdain for passengers. It’s natural. Dave

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Friends: First of all I don’t mean to offend anyone with my remarks since I love aviation and hold the aviator profession in high regard. The purpose of this message it to open the subject for discussion and learn about how other people perceive airline pilots. I will appreciate if your comments are posted in the newsgroup (rec.aviation.piloting) so that others can benefit as well. This is it. Some time ago I met the owner of a flying school that was a former airline pilot. Everytime he could, he said that when he was working as an airline pilot he was just a  " SOPHISTICATED BUS DRIVER." What is your reaction to such statement?

        More than likely, he is trying to justify to himself the fact that he now flies less, gets paid less, and has more headaches.  I believe psychologists call it "cognitive dissonanace". — Harg Tholan "He’s a poet and he knows it, cause he’s got long feet."             – Brak

Response:

They fly the plane and that’s all they care about.  Passengers are just noisy, late, demanding, and ignorant cargo.  They are best dealt with by the flight attendants.  Just like the dock workers who load the freight aboard trucks.

Well, I think that’s being a little harsh.  I’ve met flight deck crews that were exceedingly friendly and really did seem to care about the "cargo" in back. And then, I’ve been an observer during sessions when some of the loud mouthed cargo berates the crew for something totally beyond the crew’s control.  Given that vitriolic environment, I can see how easy it would be for some to become embittered towards the passengers. A show of hands of GA pilots who hate to fly the airlines. . .

Well, count me in THAT category. Remember when they served real food on real plates, in normal-sized seats. Now it’s cram ‘em into coach and toss ‘em trays of re-heated bland food in portions that would not interest the homeless.

But those aren’t the reasons why I hate flying commercial.  Hey, if you don’t like the food I have a most unique solution:  DON’T EAT IT! What I can’t stand about commercial flying is the tremendous inconvenience of it all.  You’ve got to show up an hour early so that you can wait in about 4 different lines, be treated like a criminal by security, then be herded down a jetway like cattle.  Crammed in to a seat (usually next to someone in a center seat who really should have purchased TWO tickets), delayed, delayed again, and finally when you touch down at your destination you have the joy of waiting while the 200 people on front of you get their luggage out and file out of the plane.  Ugh! And heaven help you if there’s any sort of weather delay! In my plane *I* would go when *I* want to. Sigh…… —                                 William LeFebvre                                 Group sys Consulting                                 +1 770 813 3224

Response:

Yeah, and a brain surgeon is a sophisticated butcher! — Marc Rodstein Boca Raton, FL & Harrison, Maine

Response:

In days gone by they were Lotharios of the first class! In the 50s all stews slept in a Manhattan Hotel, the Barbizon Plaza.  Pilots would linger outside the place like bloodhounds. I am still wondering why!! Old Timer.

Response:

I think that people make that "observation" because the public still thinks flying is black magic and reveres pilots. Other pilots see through the BS and feel the urge to be negative (especially GA guys). I have relatives and good friends who are airline pilots, and I am always a little taken aback by their blue-collar "anti-management", union attitude. They have no more idea about how a business works than a typical drill-press operator. That may be some of the reason that they get put down. BUT! That does not make them bad or make flying a bad profession. It is still a neat thing to do. And they enjoy what they are doing, which is most important. Also, *someone* has to do it, so why try to put them down?

 I also have a good friend who is an airline pilot, but with United.  I really haven’t heard any real "anti-management" comments from him  probably because United is now employee-owned.  While not an airline  employee myself, I can somewhat understand why some of this "us vs  them" mentality comes about.  I don’t know who started the seniority  system (unions or management), but I would guess that anytime you  have a ‘captive’ group of people locked into a company, you are  going to have a strong union for protection and that is going to  cause some friction.  Not to put all the blame on the union; when  those same employees are seen as ‘locked in’ by management, the  tendency, from a strictly business sense mind you :-) is to try  and keep wages and benefits as low as possible.  I’m an aero engineer.  Engineers don’t have unions (typically) and  companies base pay and benefits on the usually supply and demand  basis. If pay and benefits get too low, I and my fellow engineers  are free to seek higher benefits elsewhere, knowing that when we  take on another job, we don’t have to start at the entry level and  work our way back up.  Airline pilots (and other union, seniority-  based occupations) don’t have this luxury.  If their company goes  out of business, or they get fed up enough to leave, they start  at the bottom of the wage scale and work their way up again.  —Tom Turton

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – No, he’s WAY off.  Airline pilots aren’t sophisticated bus drivers. They’re more like sophisticated TRUCK Drivers. That little door that separates the cockpit from the cabin also separates two totally different worlds.  From the flight deck’s viewpoint, they could be hauling people, bombs, cargo, mail, or nothing at all. They fly the plane and that’s all they care about.  Passengers are just noisy, late, demanding, and ignorant cargo.  They are best dealt with by the flight attendants.  Just like the dock workers who load the freight aboard trucks. Unfortunately, with the increased pressures of security, scheduling, revenue maximizing, and the quest for profits, the whole airline experience has become totally de-humanized.  The flight deck crew can do little to remedy this, they end up just driving that big truck from hub to hub. A show of hands of GA pilots who hate to fly the airlines. . . Remember when they served real food on real plates, in normal-sized seats.  . Now it’s cram ‘em into coach and toss ‘em trays of re-heated bland food in portions that would not interest the homeless. All things considered, that Grumman Tiger looks more and more like the way to go. …when he was working as an airline pilot he was just a  " SOPHISTICATED BUS DRIVER."

I spend a lot more time flying commercially (60000 – 75000 miles/yr) then I do learning to fly (unfortunately).  There are a few flight deck crews who treat the passengers like cargo but all in all I’d have to say that most of them do a good job of at least acting like they care about the people who are providing the dollars in their paycheck.  I have no complaints from that regard (and no I do not work for Northwest Airlines). As far as being sophisticated bus (or truck) drivers…. When I was a teenager in the early ’70’s my best friend/next door neighbor/mentor was a flight eng on 737’s for United.  He often said that he and the other pilots didn’t get paid for what they do normally, they get paid for what they are trained to do in abnormal situations.  I haven’t seen my friend/mentor since Dec ‘92 when he went down in a crash at Chicago Midway.   Professional pilots will always be more than sophisticated bus drivers to me. Rick Slaugh

Response:

Who cares?  It’s still a lot of fun to fly an airplane and the pay’s not too bad either.  When I’m flying for the airlines, you can call me what you want but as long as I’m having fun I really don’t give a damn. Commercial ASMEL

Response:

Friends: First of all I don’t mean to offend anyone with my remarks since I love aviation and hold the aviator profession in high regard. The purpose of this message it to open the subject for discussion and learn about how other people perceive airline pilots. I will appreciate if your comments are posted in the newsgroup (rec.aviation.piloting) so that others can benefit as well. This is it. Some time ago I met the owner of a flying school that was a former airline pilot. Everytime he could, he said that when he was working as an airline pilot he was just a  " SOPHISTICATED BUS DRIVER." What is your reaction to such statement? Respectfuly, Raul Soto

Response:

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